Roleplaying Top Sales Objections For Contractors (ft. Chris Livingston)

Logan Shinholser
Hey, everyone. On today’s episode, Chris and I are talking all about the top three sales objections that contractors are getting and how to overcome them. Check it out. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to Contractor Growth network. I’m Logan.

Chris Livingston
And I’m Chris Livingston.

Logan Shinholser
And today we’re talking all about sales objections that a lot of homeowners are giving to contractors. Chris, you like this topic?

Chris Livingston
I do. Good. Let’s continue to go forward on this conversation.

Logan Shinholser
So right now, it’s the busy season. If you’re listening to this, as soon as it releases, it’s probably going to be May 2021. But this stuff doesn’t matter if it’s May 2021, November 2016, it doesn’t matter what the time is. It’s the same objections every single time. Yet it’s funny, contractors, they get the same. We’re just going to go with the big three objections here. Yet what they do is they never figure out how to overcome them or how to deal with them or how to guide somebody down that path.

Chris Livingston
I want to talk about the tactics of handling the objections, but before we do that, are you cool with just kind of talking about, like, where objections come from?

Logan Shinholser
Sure.

Chris Livingston
So straight up from you, I mean, I have my own opinion on this, but what do objections come from? Like, where are they stemming from?

Logan Shinholser
A lack of trust.

Chris Livingston
Yeah, lack of clarity. So if you are able to get in front of that, you can reduce the number of objections that you have. But if you still are getting a lot of these same objections, like lack of trust, lack of clarity on your process, lack of clarity on what this stuff costs, lack of clarity. If you are, you know, the right fit, then you’re able to utilize these tactics as well. But I think understanding the origin of objections will allow for you to be able to handle them even better than what we’re going to explain right here on this call.

Logan Shinholser
So the caveat to all this, guys, is if you’re at the point where people are throwing out a lot of price objections or they’re talking, you know, oh, I need to talk to my spouse. And you’re getting that all the time. You’ve failed already because you should not get to the point where you’re dealing with that. People should know this stuff upfront because essentially the way that the world is going at this point, and Carmax really kicked it on off is essentially upfront. We’re trying to tell people, hey, look, based on what you may or may not talk to me about is this is a ballpark of what it’s going to cost. And then here’s essentially what I want to work through with you to essentially sell you. This is what I want to sell you on.

Logan Shinholser
You don’t say it that way because then it comes off negatively. But if people feel like you’re being very transparent upfront and saying this is a ballpark of what it’s going to cost, and this is why I’m worth that, plus how my process is operated. And from a logistical standpoint, what this will look like, that is when the big dogs will win because 80% of the sale happens before you actually talk to a salesman. So right now, if you’re getting to the point where you’re trying to like navigate these waters, it’s because you’re focusing on the 20% instead of focusing on the 80%, which is really, if you focus on that, most of these objections, you’re not really going to have those anymore.

Logan Shinholser
Yep, but we’re going to go through it anyway because I know a lot of people refuse to focus on the 80%. They love doing it the hard way and they love doing the 20%.

Chris Livingston
Totally agree. And I think having a process and having an agenda and not necessarily that comes off in a bad way, but having a process and having a structure behind your calls, structure behind your process allows for you to be able to handle those rejections more, you know, easily and then also allows for your customer to feel taken care of so that they are more trusting of you and the entire process.

Logan Shinholser
So let’s walk through that. What is the value of a sales process? Why is it important to have one versus winging it every time?

Chris Livingston
And when you. I guess I can answer that question, but are you saying right now, from the homeowners perspective or from the contractors.

Logan Shinholser
Perspective, it’s pretty mutually agreeable. You know, it benefits both. So let’s just take it from the contractor’s perspective first. Why should a contractor have a sales process in place? And first off, before we even do that, I’m sorry, let’s go through that and then I’ll ask, what is a sales process? But let’s do that first. Why?

Chris Livingston
Gotcha. So why? First and foremost, I have a clear understanding of where each person’s at. I can, it’s like herding cats. I can be able to get people to go from browsers to buyers. I can help solve their problem more effectively. Having a process behind it allows me to not have to run around like a chicken with my head cut off. I’m able to say, okay, this person is right here. The next step for them to happen is everyone around me knows that the next step for them to happen is this step. Right? So if they had the initial phone call with me, great. The next step for them to do is fill out, you know, my form, send over some pictures. All right, then, except from that is have a call. So we all know what the next steps are.

Chris Livingston
And that allows for me who’s we all. Sorry, everyone in the company. Right. So that’s everyone from the contractor to if you have an admin person, whoever that may be. So, hey, this person sent over pictures. They’re not looking at you like, oh, what’s the next step they understand of. Okay, well, now they’re looking for a phone call. Okay. They haven’t had their phone call yet. Great. Let me set you up with the next person.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. So what if you’re just a one man operation, though? What’s the benefit of having it then?

Chris Livingston
Well, once again, now you have a clear understanding, because I hear so many people talking about, oh, I don’t have enough time. And I think a lot of it’s just wasted time we’re using. We’re not prepared to spend our time in the most effective way. So if you have a sales process, then you’re able to walk people down this process, have a clear understanding of where everybody is, and then at the end of the day, you are positioning yourself as someone who knows what they’re doing. So it’s not just some like Chuck.

Logan Shinholser
In the truck operation and do homeowners like that working with somebody who knows what they’re doing 100%.

Chris Livingston
They’re looking for a guide.

Logan Shinholser
Correct. Let’s flip it around. Why is it important for a contractor to have a sales process from a homeowner’s perspective?

Chris Livingston
Because I’m taken care of. I have this pain I’m dealing with, and I’m looking for someone to help guide me from where I am right now to where I want to go. And if they have a process, then I can be able to lean on that process of, okay, yeah, I feel comforted. If you were going from a flight from Atlanta to LA and you know, everybody just kind of showed up around the plane. There’s no person taking the bags. There is no, hey, what do I do? This. They hop on the plane, they don’t know who’s going to fly the plane. You know, they’re trying to pick someone out in the crowd, and then you guys are flying, and no one has any idea what the process looks like versus. Okay, hey, I got to go through TSA at the TSA.

Chris Livingston
I go to my gate. After I go to my gate, I hop on the plane, I board. Once I get on the plane, I’m going to fly the stewardesses, you know, stewardess is going to give me. Flight attendant, I apologize. The flight attendant. The flight attendant’s going to give me all the instructions. I need to have pre flight, within the flight, take care of me. We’re going to land. I’m going to exit the plane.

Logan Shinholser
So it’s structured, and everybody knows what to expect. Now, Chris, when people are saying things right now like, well, I need help with lead management, what does that mean to you?

Chris Livingston
That they need a process, and they need help being able to hone in on this process and some tools to make that process more effective and also easier.

Logan Shinholser
So why are they dealing with a lead man? Well, first off, like to you, what does lead management issue mean?

Chris Livingston
Well, just not having a process that is effective for them and their homeowner, because just because you have a process, and if the homeowner is not willing to follow it, then, you know, you’re kind of sol in that situation. And everyone has a process. Sometimes your process is a different one every single time, but you have a process. And maybe that process is inconsistency, but I. You have a process, and you need to have one that is both beneficial for you and also for the homeowner.

Logan Shinholser
So the point behind why we need to have a process, in my mind, is imagine you’re a home builder, and the first thing you always got to do is you got to lay the foundation of the house. But let’s just say this time we go, man, let’s just put the, let’s do the framing first, then we’ll start to put up the drywall. Then we’ll put the foundation down. Does that work?

Chris Livingston
No.

Logan Shinholser
Why?

Chris Livingston
Because you have unsteady ground. It’s nothing. The right process to go forward with something correct.

Logan Shinholser
And in your own business, the way that you build, you probably have a very set process of doing things where you’re not starting with brand new, you know, a different material every time. You’re not starting from scratch, you know, and reinventing the wheel every time you build something. Yet when it comes to how you sell, how you operate, right. If you have, let’s say, a follow up system where you want to follow up with leads, if, you know, on day one, day three, day four, day seven, and day nine, you’re going to call them, and every day in between, then you’re going to email them, which sounds like a lot, but just giving you a frame of reference, if you do that and you see it works, well, great. Now you know it works.

Logan Shinholser
But if you do all that and it doesn’t work, well, now, you know, to shift and move. But if with one lead, you call them on day four and day nine, and that’s it, and the next lead, you call them on day one and that’s it. Like, we don’t know what works. So how can you ever get better at something if you’re changing it every single time? It’s tough.

Chris Livingston
What I’m hearing from most people, and probably what I’m dealing with myself as I close on this home is the communication piece. And if I, this person has a process, I have a clear understanding of when I should be able to. My next touch point, you know, for this whole build right now that I’m dealing with. I don’t.

Logan Shinholser
And just for frame reference, Chris is. He bought a home that’s being built right now. So that’s what he’s referring to.

Chris Livingston
Gotcha. Appreciate that. So.

Logan Shinholser
Gotcha. Didn’t know that.

Chris Livingston
Thanks, man. Somebody tell Megan who’s Chris? But, so for that frame of reference is, I. I understand I’m not building this home. All right? So. And I understand that there’s gonna be different factors that are gonna allow it to be, you know, happen earlier or later. I just wanna be in the know of where I am at in this process so that I can take care of my things, you know? Hey, is the lender situation already taken care of? You know, should we have already gotten the refrigerator? You know, what about other appliances? So, understanding where you are in the process is super important for me as a consumer. So if you have a process and people always talk about, oh, my communication is great, all right, but is your communication working for you?

Chris Livingston
Do you have a process that you’re able to say, hey, at this point, you know that I will communicate this to you so you don’t have to be left in the dark, because as a consumer, no matter what you’re buying, that’s maybe your biggest frustration. You’re sitting at the restaurant and you ordered this a long time ago. You have no idea when it’s coming out. You’ve been sitting there forever. If the hostess comes up to you and says, hey, your food’s actually going to come out in about 15 minutes from now, we’re actually a little bit behind. That gives me peace of mind to understanding an idea of expectations.

Logan Shinholser
So what you’re saying is people are not so frustrated, necessarily, with like, hey, I’ve got a lead time of a week. They’re more frustrated with the fact that you’re not communicating that with them. So it’s time to start to communicate that more. And with this last caveat on the sales process, guys, a lot of this stuff, again, 80% of people are going to be buying before they even call you. They’re already mentally bought in, or they’re already mentally checked out based on what they’re seeing online, based on what they’re seeing with reviews, based on what they’re seeing in their neighborhood. So if you’re not focusing on the 80% and you right now you’re just going, well, I just want a couple tactics on how to sell.

Logan Shinholser
Well, you’re going to know how to nail it on the 20%, but you’re going to skip over the other 80%. So you ready jump into actually some role play and go through the top three different objections that we hear.

Chris Livingston
Let’s go for it.

Logan Shinholser
Cool. So we’re going to do price first. Chris, what percentage of people here do you think hear the objection of that’s too much money?

Chris Livingston
I would say. I mean, everybody does.

Logan Shinholser
Because 100%.

Chris Livingston
Yeah, because it doesn’t matter if you’re doing handyman services to, you’re doing custom builds that are, you know, million dollars plus, it’s. The reality is for somebody, that’s more money than they expected to pay.

Logan Shinholser
And again, that’s back to not having a process upfront that educates people, that does the Carmax model. So let’s go through that, Chris. So do you want to play the contractor or you want to play the homeowner?

Chris Livingston
Whatever is easiest for you.

Logan Shinholser
All right, I’ll be homeowner. You ready? All right, so, Chris. All right, man. A million dollars for a home, like, that’s a lot more money than I wanted to spend. That’s a lot.

Chris Livingston
Okay, just curious, what do you mean?

Logan Shinholser
Well, I guess coming into this, I was thinking maybe 600 grand on a home. I wasn’t really ready to spend a million dollars, so it’s just. It’s a lot more than I thought.

Chris Livingston
Okay. Can I. Can I kind of share with you? I normally have two different types of clients. Can I kind of share with those two different types of clients with you?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, sure.

Chris Livingston
All right, so the first client that I normally work with is someone who has this idea of exactly what they want. And by no means is it ever a compromise to change that idea. They’ve got this idea in their head and they want to get it. So price necessarily is not the biggest factor for them. All right. For other people, sometimes they do kind of have a budget, right. So they maybe have this idea of exactly what they want, but they’re able to bend that a little bit so that they can best taken care of within their price range, I guess, for you. So I can best take care of you. Which one best describes you.

Logan Shinholser
For me, I mean, like, I have a little bit of wiggle room, but not 600 grand. Up to a million. That’s kind of a lot.

Chris Livingston
Okay. Do you mind sharing so I can be able to take care of you? Like, what your wiggle room looks like or what you got are hoping to.

Logan Shinholser
Spend probably high end 700.

Chris Livingston
Okay. So it sounds like if we get around that $700 range, $700,000 range, then, and we’re able to accomplish what we want to accomplish, you’ll be happy with that?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, I’m good with that.

Chris Livingston
Okay, so let’s talk about that. You’re probably going to hate me for saying this, but there may be, when went through the things we talked about, there may be a few things we kind of have to take off or. What are your thoughts on that?

Logan Shinholser
Okay. Yeah, I mean, I’m okay with taking some stuff off, I guess. What do we need to take out?

Chris Livingston
And that would kind of depend on you. So we can do a couple different things I can kind of explain to you, if you’re okay with it, just a couple things that drive the cost up and some things that kind of keep it relatively closer to our range.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. Yeah, go ahead.

Chris Livingston
All right, so it’s different things. So maybe from materials, maybe, you know, lead times on certain, you know, certain items. Let’s do this. Let’s kind of walk through your list of what you want to have, and then we’ll kind of put priorities on the most important thing so you can kind of go. We talked a little bit about that. You know, the home. And for most people, what they’re looking for is a kitchen is the centerpiece of their home, the bedrooms and maybe any additional room. All right, so are in your world right now, is there of those, are those the three things that are basic for you? Are you looking for something outside of there that’s super important to having in your home?

Logan Shinholser
No. Like, the kitchen is big. You know, having four bedrooms is also pretty important. So I guess for me, you know, having the kitchen and having four bedrooms is like, you know, the most important pieces to it.

Chris Livingston
Gotcha. Is there anything else? Because sometimes I talk to people, and it’s about, you know, outdoor, the outdoor area. They spend a lot of time outdoors, or maybe they, you know, they’ve have accustomed to using their garage for a lot more. For you, is there anything specific? Like, hey, Chris, at the end of this, I know I talked to you about $700,000, and I want to make sure that this comes in with that as well.

Logan Shinholser
That mean that’s. That’s merely it. There’s a few other things that, you know, like nice appliances, like nice refrigerator. I’m really looking forward to that because I keep seeing them online and they look really cool. Then having. For the master bathroom, having like, a standalone bathtub.

Chris Livingston
Okay, gotcha. So if we’re taking care of the bathroom, we’re taking care of. So along with those bedrooms. And just so I understand, like, the bedrooms, how do you guys plan on using those bedrooms, to sleep?

Logan Shinholser
What do you mean?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, that’s a good question. I kind of probably phrased that in the wrong way. So sometimes I talk to people and they. They’re, you know, necessarily empty nesters, but they’re having their families come in all the time, or they’re having a lot of visitors, or sometimes it’s just, you know, thinking about possibly Airbnb and their place out. When I talked to you earlier, I thought it was just you and your wife and I might have been off on that. But how do you guys plan on how you guys plan on seeing, using the other three bedrooms in the house?

Logan Shinholser
Oh, yeah. So for right now, I mean, we’ll probably have one just cause we’re still working from home during all this. We’ll have one set up as, like an office, as a makeshift office. But, we are empty nesters, but our kids are probably gonna have grandkids soon. So to be able to have them come over and actually feel comfortable in our home. So for the most part, they’re gonna be empty, but they will be used for guest rooms, essentially.

Chris Livingston
Okay, so for you in that world, how many of those you feel like consistently you’re gonna have to use for guest rooms?

Logan Shinholser
Probably. I mean, so if you have four bedrooms, one’s gonna be a master, which means that we have three non. And then probably two would be a guest room, and then one would just. I guess maybe you stay as the office.

Chris Livingston
Okay. For my notes, and I want to make sure I take care of you. Is the third. Is the fourth guest, or is this the third guest bedroom and the fourth overall room? Is. Is that a non negotiable.

Logan Shinholser
Not necessarily. I mean, I’m okay with if we can’t do it. I mean, you know, we’re not going to be in Covid forever, and we’re going to go back to the office. So it’s not like it’s. We have to have it.

Chris Livingston
Okay. So what are your thoughts on this? Well, I know we kind of discussed a lot of different things, but what are your thoughts on if we downsize just a little bit on that fourth bedroom, give you a little extra room when it comes to your overall, you know, your bedroom itself, the two other bedrooms, and be able to take care of, you know, the kitchen as well.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. I mean, is that going to knock off $300,000, though?

Chris Livingston
It won’t, but it’ll give us a lot closer to that.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, cool. And let’s just stop it there. So, Chris, walk me through your mindset. What. What were you trying to do there?

Chris Livingston
What I was trying to do was recognize that this person had an expectation of spending $600,000, and I came in at the million dollar mark to take care of their dreams. All right. So I also then wanted to go ahead and frame the situation, let them know that I’ve taken care of this problem before and asked them where they feel like they felt in that box. Right. So I painted two boxes and allowed themselves to put themselves in one of them. Hey, some people out there are saying by no means at all, am I ever going to compromise on what I want. This is what I want, and we got to figure this out together to get what I want.

Chris Livingston
Or is it along the lines of, hey, I’m kind of more price conscious, and I know that there may be some limitations to what I want. So I had this idea, but I’m willing to take a step back on that as well.

Logan Shinholser
I love that you did that because I find a lot of people, what they do is they go into this arrogance mode and they go, whoa, you want a $600,000 home? I’m sorry. You want a million dollar home for $600,000? Like, not everybody can afford us. And they jump into conclusions instead of saying, well, let’s. Let’s dial it back a little bit. Let’s reverse engineer. So the fact that you started to work within the money that I had, and I recognize, you know, that there are, or we all need to recognize that there are minimum job sizes that we can do. So if somebody says, look, I only have $200,000 on this home, and your homes start at 400 grand, there’s not much that you’re going to want to do for that, because it’s just not worth it.

Chris Livingston
And I was probably, at that point, was going to fall on the sword and say, hey, can I be straight up with you? Like, our minimum job is around $450,000. And I know you talked about $200,000. I guess, like, what? Do you feel like we should go from here?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, I was. And this is going back to the whole, like, having stuff done up front. Like, I was going to schedule something today with a software company, and they said, hey, if you are not doing these numbers, don’t bother. And I was like, great, guess what we didn’t do. I didn’t waste their time, and they didn’t waste my time, and they were just. I mean, so once we get to that threshold, then I’ll reengage and say, great, I’m ready to go forward. Now, I’ve worked up to this point, but I’m just not there. And it’s not my fault. It’s not their fault that we’re not a good fit. It’s just we got boundaries.

Chris Livingston
Yeah. And you didn’t have to deal with the embarrassment of going there and finding out, okay, well, hey, we’re not the best fit. And they didn’t have to waste their time, you know, dealing with you, the correspondence back and forth to find out after, you know, 30 minutes of time that, you know, Logan’s not the best fit for us right now.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. So I love that they did that. They did it up front. And I think that’s something that the embarrassment side is. What we forget about is that when somebody goes, oh, I was only thinking, five grand, and you’re coming at me with a $20,000 bathroom. They’re embarrassed because now they have to say no. Nobody likes to say no to somebody else. Like, it’s just. It’s not in our natural DNA to want to do that. So for as awkward as is for you as a contractor, it’s equally as awkward. The homeowner. And that’s why the homeowner then just ghosts you over and over, because they don’t want to be the bearer of bad news, so they’d rather just not even deal with it and just leave you on red and to.

Chris Livingston
Kind of go back again. Like, what the overall goal for that was, I was looking to help handle that objection together. All right. Find out really what was going on in their world. Like, what would they. What were they planning on using these things for? Hey, let me be your guide. Let me be your guide to help take some things off. You ask the question, is taking away one bedroom going to, you know, stop it? The reality was no, but I can be confident in saying that. But, hey, it’s going to be a little closer and we can kind of dial back from that.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, cool. You feel good on the price one?

Chris Livingston
Let’s do it.

Logan Shinholser
You want to do the, Let’s. I got to talk to my spouse. I got to talk to my accountant. I got to talk to somebody else.

Chris Livingston
Yes, do it.

Logan Shinholser
You want to do it?

Chris Livingston
Yep.

Logan Shinholser
All right. I’ll be the contractor and you be the homeowner.

Chris Livingston
All right. Sounds good.

Logan Shinholser
Okay.

Chris Livingston
Hey. Yeah, so that sounds pretty good. Mandy, what I need to do is I need to talk to my spouse about all this, but I appreciate your time.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, man, of course. I’m curious, Chris, what are you looking to talk to your spouse about?

Chris Livingston
Oh, well. Well, I just got to talk to Megan because that’s just kind of how we always do things and, you know, and I don’t know, I just got to kind of talk to her about everything you said.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. What do you think Megan is going to say about our conversation?

Chris Livingston
Honestly? She’s going to say it’s quite a bit of money.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. And I’m just curious, Chris, how important in this decision is she?

Chris Livingston
Definitely, definitely important. You know, we’re going to make this decision together, so it’s definitely important.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. And that makes sense because in my household it’s the same thing. So what if we get Megan on the phone right now and the three of us can chat? How would that work?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, I mean, I feel like that would be a good idea. I mean, right now she’s probably out right now with her newborn, and I don’t know if she can be on the phone right now, but. But I think definitely having a conversation together would be important.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. I like that, Chris. And do you mind if I share why?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, sure, go ahead.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. Because in my role, Chris, I get it. I’m married to. I understand how it all works. And I know for me, if I go back to my wife and just say, hey, honey, we’re going to do this for 20 grand, she’s going to not hear the entire conversation that you and I just had.

Chris Livingston
Yeah.

Logan Shinholser
All she’s going to hear is $20,000. And if you go back to Megan and say that, what do you think she’s going to say?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, same thing. She’s going to be like, yeah, were talking about twelve and now it’s 20.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. And for you, Chris, realistically, what’s your, you know, what’s your thought on all this? Is this something that you were looking for?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, I mean, we. This hall bathroom has been a pain in our butt for some time, and I think if we can just. Go ahead, knock it out. It’s huge. I mean, I even thought about doing it on my own, but it’s just daunting, and that’s not something I want to do.

Logan Shinholser
What’s Megan’s thought on this? Does she want you to do this?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, I mean, she’s. She. I called because I kind of know this stuff a little bit better than she does. But. But, yeah, we both have an interest in doing this. I mean, kids growing up and having. Right now we’re, you know, washing the baby in our own master bath. But in a couple years, we need to have this taken care of and we’re having family visit more now, and the hall bath is just pretty bad.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, that makes sense to me. What’s the motivating factor for Megan? I guess. Why does she want this done?

Chris Livingston
Stop being a headache. Stop having to have guests come over and use our either downstairs bathroom or, you know, to shower. They kind of use our master. We’ve had several people, you know, friends and family come over that decided to even get hotels rather than stay with us.

Logan Shinholser
Man, what’s that like?

Chris Livingston
Not great. I mean, it’s something we should have taken care of a long time ago, but, you know, kids and everything, kind of transitioning in life. We kind of figured this out. But like I said, I just didn’t. We didn’t know it was gonna cost 20,000. So that’s something we just didn’t know.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, just curious. Before hopping on this call, I guess, what did you and Megan discuss about what you were hoping to invest in this?

Chris Livingston
We really didn’t. I mean, I was thinking a budget around twelve. Did a little bit of like, you know, research online and saw something on, like, I think was like, thumbtack or whatnot. It said around $12,000 was average, and I thought we’d probably be getting the average. But from what you said, I mean, I see the value. I just, you know, it’s more than we originally thought.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. How do you feel about this conversation that you and I just had?

Chris Livingston
Good. I think it’s got to convince Megandhenne.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, cool. So I’m happy to hop back on the phone with the two of you guys. When do you want to make that happen?

Chris Livingston
So she’s free on Wednesdays? I guess. I mean, are you free on Wednesdays, too?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, I mean, so that’s tomorrow. So we can chat tomorrow. What time works for you?

Chris Livingston
Maybe two.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, now between now and tomorrow at 02:00 what’s going to stop the three of us from hopping back on that phone call?

Chris Livingston
I need to get a hold of Megan in and let her know we’re having that call and not let anything get in the way.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. Cause what I don’t want to have happen, I don’t want to blindside her with all this stuff, because I know what we’re talking about is a little bit different than what you guys have maybe talked about before. But I want to make sure that, you know, we go through all this together to make sure that with this bathroom, it’s exactly what you and Megan both want. And we can talk about the pricing again then I. Yeah, true.

Chris Livingston
Yeah, I think. Yeah, I think hopping on a call tomorrow together probably be easier for us to kind of. She’ll be able to ask her questions as well and be able to get some clarity on that.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, beautiful. And in the meantime, between now and tomorrow at 02:00 would I help if I just send over a video of a project that’s pretty similar to the one that we just talked about that you’re looking to have done?

Chris Livingston
Actually, yeah, that’d be huge. Especially. I can be able to show Megan as well.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, cool. So is this your cell phone?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, it is.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, I’ll shoot it over to you and we’ll talk tomorrow at 02:00 and I’ll just give you a call.

Chris Livingston
All right, sounds good, brother.

Logan Shinholser
Cool. Thanks.

Chris Livingston
Thanks, man. That was good. But before I say that, what are your thoughts? What was your kind of goal behind it?

Logan Shinholser
So my goal is to essentially humanize the situation. We all have to talk to our spouse. And typically, I had one of two ways I was going to go with that. It was either going to go the soft, gentle route where. And that’s the vibe you were giving me, or the other vibe would have been, hey, Chris, aside from talking to your wife, what? Or, Megan, what else is going to stop you from moving forward to get the real reason, to get the real deep down reason of, well, it’s just a lot more money than I. That I wanted to spend. And then we would have jumped back into the price objection. One which would have spiraled, you know, back to that. I just didn’t want to redo the same role play, but just a little bit better.

Chris Livingston
You’re an idiot.

Logan Shinholser
Even Aaron’s laughing at that one.

Chris Livingston
Aaron’s shaking his head.

Logan Shinholser
So with the spouse one, I wanted to humanize the situation and just go, Chris, I get it, man. In my house, it’s. It’s pretty similar, right. If I go back to my wife. So essentially what I’m trying to do is, this is not an objection that happens once every blue moon. This happens so commonly. And the reason that people do it again, we don’t want to make assumptions in sales. At the same time, if 90% of people are giving you this objection. I’m sorry, if everybody’s giving you this objection 90% of the time, it’s the same thought process.

Chris Livingston
Yeah.

Logan Shinholser
Where they just. They don’t wanna go back and tell the spouse the number, but the spouse wasn’t on the call. So if I can essentially call out their problem but put it on myself or go talk about another. Hey, can I share with you what another homeowner did in this situation? Sure. So all I’m trying to do is humanize the situation, let you know that the feelings that you’re having are valid, because in my house, it’s the same thing. And then guide you through what’s important to not only you, but even more importantly, what is important to Megan. I want to set that follow up call, and I want to make sure in between now and then, I know if you go back and say, Megan, it’s 20 grand, she’s going to say, I’m out.

Logan Shinholser
So I want to make sure we kind of guide the situation to make sure that we don’t have that scenario. And that’s also why I said, can I shoot you over a video to try to at least nurture a little bit more, to get her more excited, to at least have a discussion about what’s going to happen.

Chris Livingston
And I liked how you framed it, where all the different activities towards the end were positioned towards me. It was like, hey, let’s work together to be able to solve this problem for you and Megan, like you have. You have the big responsibility to be able to do a lot of the burden to figure the situation out. But Megan’s going to be involved, too. Let’s make sure she is involved and she’s taken care of so that you become out the hero as well.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. The spouse won. You’re going to have it with the spouse. I’ve heard it. Well, I got to talk to my accountant. Like what? Your accountant? About what? Well, I got. I got to see if I have the money here. Okay. And in our world, we talk to business owners. It’s like, okay, timeout. Blunt question. Do you know how much money you have in your bank account right now for the business? Yeah, I do. Okay, well, if you know how much you have in your bank account, I guess, what’s. What’s the showstopper here? That’s when I would go a little bit more on the hard, aggressive line of like, okay, so clearly, you have the money, but you’re still asking your accountant. Hey, I’m just curious what else you have to ask your accountant about. Oh, well, we just have. Taxes are coming up.

Logan Shinholser
Okay. What do you think you’re going to spend in taxes? Well, I have no idea. Okay, so let’s go through that, because here’s what I’m trying to understand. And, like, I like calling out what I think is the obvious. I’m trying to understand. Do you actually not know how much you’re going to pay in taxes? So that’s a real situation, which, if that’s the case, we got a bigger issue here. Because you have no idea how much money is going in and out of the bank account, or are you really just a little bit hesitant because this was not the amount of money that you were looking to spend?

Chris Livingston
Yeah.

Logan Shinholser
And if you just call it out, you know, I’ve done it before where it’s like, oh, that’s ten grand. I don’t know. I can’t spend that. Okay, blunt question. Do you not see the value in the. In what we’re selling, or do you literally not have $10,000 in your bank account? Because if they say, I literally don’t have 10,000, that’s totally different. That’s a very different conversation. Then why don’t I have 100,000? I don’t see the value then. It’s not a price objection. It’s a clarity. Objection. So a lot of times, the. It’s the surface level of what they’re giving you is not actually, when I say a lot of times, it’s never the surface level. It’s never, oh, that’s a lot more money. Well, it’s not a lot more money. People are not afraid to spend the money.

Logan Shinholser
People are afraid that it’s not going to be what they want or they’re. It’s. They’re not understanding that it’s actually going to solve the deep down problem. Not the problem of it’s an outdated kitchen, but the problem of, I want to make memories with my family before my kids graduate high school.

Chris Livingston
Yep.

Logan Shinholser
So the spouse one, it’s big. You’re going to get it a lot. Biggest thing there is, if you can have it up front, you know, especially like. Cause I’ve heard Chris do role plays with people where they say, oh, like, and Chris will give them the objection of, I gotta talk to my spouse. And they go, well, let me just. Let me text you a couple, just photos of this and that. And the reason I did the video one in this case is video is gonna hit a little bit harder. What I would have probably done, especially if you have a CGN thing, send over the website, hey, let me just send that over to you.

Logan Shinholser
Because that essentially walks through the entire journey of what the buyer is thinking and feeling, and that will call out their pain and what they’re looking to have done from a solution standpoint, the same way that we’re talking and explaining it now. That’s all done upfront. So when the wife looks and goes, or Megan looks and goes, well, that’s a lot of money. But then she reads the rest of it, she goes, oh, now I get where they’re coming from. So to have those little tools in your tool belt versus just saying, okay, great, I’ll talk to you tomorrow. Everybody says time kills deals, which is totally true. But if you don’t nurture between now and then, I, that’s a much higher chance of getting got.

Chris Livingston
And I think having that process was huge. Like having a process of, okay, we hopped on this phone call. I got this. Objection. This is what the next step is. The next step is for me to find out, you know, really the importance of having your spouse or significant other there and then. Now let’s talk about this and having a process. I’m gonna send you over a video. We’re gonna schedule another call. Because, yeah, it’s not right for you to make the decision right now. It doesn’t make any sense. But let’s nurture you a little bit more because you’re just not there yet. And then you’re able to find out if I’m really concerned about the price or am I really concerned about Megan or what it really looks like for me.

Logan Shinholser
So you ready? Jump into the last objection. That’s very common, which is I’m either too busy or I don’t have enough time.

Chris Livingston
Yep, sure. I’m going to do that. From the contractors perspective is contract.

Logan Shinholser
Yep. Contractors perspective. So which one you want to be?

Chris Livingston
It’s up to you, Aaron.

Logan Shinholser
Which one? Who’s contractor here? You did. And then you did. Okay, so Chris is up. Contractor.

Chris Livingston
Okay.

Logan Shinholser
Hey, Chris? Yeah, man. I mean, I definitely want to do it, but now is just, you know, not the right time to do this.

Chris Livingston
And what. And what do you mean by that?

Logan Shinholser
Well, you know, we’re. It’s. It’s May. We’re about to go on summer vacation and everything, so, realistically, I’m looking to have this kitchen done. Maybe, I don’t know, sometime early next year.

Chris Livingston
Okay. Sometime early next year. Okay. What. What was the big motivation for you to reach out, I guess, now.

Logan Shinholser
I guess just to look into the process of this or understand how it all works. Like, I’m. I’m kind of a planner, so I was just trying to get a good understanding of, you know, maybe get a couple estimates and then see what it costs to then kind of make a decision from there.

Chris Livingston
Gotcha. Sounds like you’re doing your research.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Chris Livingston
Can I ask you a pretty blunt question?

Logan Shinholser
Sure.

Chris Livingston
What. What are you planning to solve? So most of them, I talk to people, and they’ve got something big going on. Their life from a new kitchen. Either. It’s. They got kids that are growing up, and they’re sick and tired of, like, you know, not spending time with their kids, or even they’ve got a big event coming up, and they’re. They’re now hosting it for their family, I guess. In your world, like, what’s going on?

Logan Shinholser
Well, I mean, it’s an outdated kitchen. You know, I definitely like to spend, you know, open it up, like what we talked about, where it’s more spacious, that we can hang out together as a family, so it’s not as isolated.

Chris Livingston
And when you say we hang out, like, who is that?

Logan Shinholser
Myself, my wife, my two kids.

Chris Livingston
Okay. I write down some pretty detailed notes. Do you mind sharing, so I can put in the notes. Your wife’s name?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. Audrey.

Chris Livingston
Audrey. Okay, so you, Audrey, and your kids, how are they?

Logan Shinholser
Eight and nine.

Chris Livingston
Eight and nine years old. Okay. When you. What are your thoughts on. How are you going to spend time with them in this kitchen? Because if you’re building it in the sense of. For them, I mean, how are they planning on enjoying this?

Logan Shinholser
You know, my wife likes to cook. She’s big on that. She’s pretty traditional from her upbringing, so she’s big on, like, family dinners and stuff like that. You know, I’d like to have a breakfast bar there. I’d like to.

Chris Livingston
A breakfast bar, you said? I don’t hear that too often. I mean, we do breakfast bars, but people actually knowing that, like, right off the top. They want that, I guess.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. I mean, I just, like, you know, I’ll just give you. So last year were in, or I guess two years at this point, were actually down in Cancun for a vacation, and it was super cool because the room that we had there, it was nice where we could cook. And then in the room, they actually had a high table that was like a breakfast bar that our kids would sit there and enjoy. So it was like. It was super cool to have a breakfast bar there. So it was nice.

Chris Livingston
All right. Sounds like you were spending a lot of time with these kids.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, I mean, were trying to be pretty present in their life. I recognize that. You know, with social media and stuff like that, it’s very easy to kind of, you know, go into our phones and get wrapped up into it. So the more that we’re able to, I don’t know, I guess, foster an environment of communication. That’s really what I’m hoping for here.

Chris Livingston
Okay. You and I know you talked about doing it. Wouldn’t you say, next year? At what time?

Logan Shinholser
Just. I mean, I’m not in a huge rush on this, you know? So I don’t know. It’s maybe, like February, January, February of next year, just after the holidays.

Chris Livingston
Just curious, how long do you feel like a kitchen remodel would take?

Logan Shinholser
I don’t know, like a couple months.

Chris Livingston
You ready for some good news?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah.

Chris Livingston
So, generally, with us, the whole process is about two weeks long, actually. The build. We do everything we can to get you know, you have to be outside your home or outside of your kitchen for a little bit about that two weeks. We set you up with some stuff, but most of them, I talk to people, and they feel like it’s a lot bigger of a deal than they’re actually going through.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, I mean, that’s great. Like, I like the. You know, it’s two weeks is great, but still, like, I just, you know, kind of want to wait a little bit on this.

Chris Livingston
Okay. Just. Just curious, what. What are your. What are your thoughts on what this cost? I mean, have you gone over it all and what you’re kind of planning on spending at all, or.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, I mean, that’s something I got to talk to my wife about. I guess we’re probably looking at, I don’t know, maybe, like, 25 or 30 grand. And I know what, you know, what you gave me was something closer to 50 or 60. So part of it’s trying to plan and save up for that amount, you know, go that route.

Chris Livingston
Okay. That 50 or 60, is that something you guys are set on getting? What we kind of described the scope of work we worked on or you guys are looking for is a 50 or 60 something that just totally outside of you guys budget?

Logan Shinholser
No, I mean, like, 56 is not totally outside of our budget. It’s just, you know, I gotta save up for it. I’m pretty big on not overspending, you know, when I don’t have to necessarily.

Chris Livingston
Okay.

Logan Shinholser
So. And I want that kitchen. I’m okay with taking a couple of things away maybe, but, like, I really want that kitchen. I’ve been pretty meticulous about what’s on that list, like our desire list. And I’m good. Again, I’m good with waiting until that time. I just want to make sure that we have the money saved up.

Chris Livingston
Okay. Have you guys already done some material planning and things like that as well?

Logan Shinholser
No.

Chris Livingston
Okay, what are your thoughts on this? It sounds like you guys are pretty bought in on getting this kitchen. You know, getting it for you and your family is super important, but maybe finding out a little bit later on the date to be able to save a little money and kind of go through with that. Sometimes we’re booked out, sometimes, you know, we kind of have different times. Would it make sense for us to kind of talk about maybe securing a certain spot in your calendar? Is there something, a certain event that’s coming up?

Logan Shinholser
There’s no event coming up necessarily. Just, you know, I want to get this done and probably within the next year.

Chris Livingston
Okay. When’s the latest? You’re like, absolutely. There’s no way I’m ever going to say I don’t want to step in front of my kitchen if it’s not done at this point.

Logan Shinholser
Maybe this time next year.

Chris Livingston
Okay, this time next year. So a year from now, if we’re out, pushed out a little bit. Okay, I’m looking at that. Would it help if I kind of, we kind of nurture together in the meantime?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah.

Chris Livingston
Okay. Because what I’m hearing is there’s a lot of different things, so it. Who else is going to be involved in? You said you and your, and my wife. And you and your wife. Is she planning it all in the kitchen as well or.

Logan Shinholser
She likes it, but she’s pretty busy with work, so she’s essentially just kind of hands off and letting me do it.

Chris Livingston
Can I tell you? That’s kind of surprising to hear, and I don’t hear that often, so that’s why it’s surprising to kind of hear that, because most time I’m hearing people, like, they spend a lot of time in the kitchen together. And it’s like, normally it’s a. Cooking is like a family kind of event, so they both kind of have say in it.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. So, I mean, I work from home, and she works in the office, so I’m home a lot. She’s really only there in the mornings and evenings. I mean, and then obviously weekends and stuff like that. So the goal is to, you know, make it that when she comes home, it’s nice. It’s easy. She still likes to cook and stuff like that, but it’s a more inviting environment, so hopefully she won’t be working as late.

Chris Livingston
Okay. And right now, what’s going on in your world right now that’s not nice and inviting? This sounds like it’s just.

Logan Shinholser
It’s small. It’s just an old kitchen. It’s not functional for what we’re looking to do.

Chris Livingston
This probably out of place, but I sometimes hear people talk about, like, even the kitchen size sometimes even causes arguments and stuff. I hear all types of wazoo things.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, we don’t really argue that much, so that’s not really an issue.

Chris Livingston
Gotcha. I’m glad it’s not. What are your thoughts on this? So it sounds like you guys looking for a kitchen to go forward with everything, you know, how about we do this? I want to send you over some stuff so you’re not blindsided by anything. So that this time next year, there’s a kitchen sitting in your home. You know, you guys are actually able to utilize it. You know, do you got. Do you read at all? Is it mostly videos? How do you normally look at your research?

Logan Shinholser
I’m definitely a reader.

Chris Livingston
Okay.

Logan Shinholser
Definitely a reader. So I like to check out, you know, forums and blogs and stuff like that.

Chris Livingston
Gotcha. Yeah. So we do have a couple blogs on our website that talks about different trends, maybe kind of what drives the cost up or drives the cost down so that you can be able to share that with Audrey so that she’s able to also understand as well. What are your thoughts, me sending that over to you?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, it’d be great.

Chris Livingston
Okay. So what I’ll do is I’m gonna put you in our pipeline. And what that means is I’m gonna reach out to you quite often. Not overbearingly, but I wanna make sure that, you know, sometimes people talk about communication and they feel as if the contractor kind of dropped off. All right, so what I’m gonna do is I’m gonna send out a blog to you today, right now. And what I’m gonna do is I’m just gonna reach out to you and what I want you to be comfortable with. Because sometimes I talk to people and they said, hey, we’ve kind of gone another direction and things like that. I want you to be comfortable.

Chris Livingston
At some point, if you feel as if you guys are going to go another direction, be able to let me know that so that I don’t feel like I’m chasing you or you don’t feel like you’re being chased. Is that cool?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah.

Chris Livingston
Okay. So you want to just do that?

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. All right.

Chris Livingston
So I’m going to send that over to you, and it sounds good.

Logan Shinholser
Okay, cool. So add a role play. Chris, what was the thought process there?

Chris Livingston
Well, I was trying to find out how important this was to you. I tried to dig a little deeper and to see if there was any real pain that you’re dealing with. It sounded like you were, the person that was dealing with it the most. You did spend a lot of money and time for the family. And so I thought in my mind, like, right now, it’s, I don’t think you’re going to fully stick all the way until next year. But it’s just you guys were not expecting to spend that right now, and so having to justify that was. It was a big burden to do.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. So I liked that you set it up for the future. Hey, look, this is what we’re gonna do. This is when we’re gonna do it. In the meantime, I’m gonna nurture you. So I like how you did that. And you even gave a reason. Not for like a, hey, I wanna make sure that you don’t, you know, forget about me. But it’s like, hey, I wanna make sure that you don’t feel like I messed up. So that was fantastic. The only thing that I would have added to that is I would have done one of two things. I’ve done two things. One is, hey, like, okay, so you’re looking at 30. Like, if what we talked about, you know, if I would have come back with 30. Yeah, what would. What would you have done then?

Logan Shinholser
Because if they would have said, oh, I still would have waited until next year, then it’s. It’s really. It’s gonna be tough then it’s a time thing, but if it’s like, oh, I would say, now, you know, it’s a money thing, only the other side of it is, well, the beginning we talked about. Why do you want it? Well, I want to be able to hang out with my kids more before they leave the house and stuff like that. Okay, great. Like what? How are y’all doing that right now?

Chris Livingston
Yeah, I was trying to dive into a little bit of that kid piece, but I think that you’re hundred percent correct that there’s when you have to find out what the real objection is. So if they give you the surface level of oh, we want to wait. Well, hey, in my mind I was trying either, if I was going to try to get you put some money down now, small micro commitment towards something. Hey, let’s go and secure your spot on the calendar with this stuff. And you know, have you guys done some consultation already on this? Alright, well, hey, it sounds like you guys want to do this. Let’s go ahead and put some money down now or vanguard the situation of, hey, I’m going to reach out to you quite often.

Chris Livingston
I’m going to be in your world and because we’re going to take care of this together. So that at the very least, if you do go forward with something, you’re going to go forward with us or you’re going to have an active thought of not going forward with us.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. And with all this stuff, I like that a lot of this just this can be circumvented up front. Right. If you put your efforts into the 80% of the buying decision, which happens before the actual sales call, then you’re good.

Chris Livingston
Yep.

Logan Shinholser
But if you’re waiting until this point now, Chris kind of has his back against the wall a little bit.

Chris Livingston
Yeah. Because if you had no idea what the stuff costs, like, there’s no reason at all someone should be calling you, not having an idea or being like being 100%, legitimately, 100% financially off on what you’re, once you’re costing.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah. So all the stuff the sales process is super important, everybody focuses on, well, how do I deal with the objections? That’s all they want to know is because everybody thinks, well, I’m really good at sales. Okay, well, how much sales training you ever had? Well, I’ve watched a lot of YouTube videos. Oh, okay. I’ve read a lot of Webmd. I’m not a surgeon. So there’s a very difference, very big difference between practice and actually, you know, I’m sorry, practice of doing it versus just like reading about it.

Chris Livingston
Yeah.

Logan Shinholser
So with this stuff, it’s so funny when it comes to the objections is objections typically happen near the end of the sales call. Nobody ever talks about what happens before all that stuff happens. Everybody just cares about the objections because they think with the objections. Well, that’s not a me thing. It’s a them thing. They’re the ones that are too cheap. So how do I overcome that? They’re the ones that are too wimpy to give me a yes or no. So they need to talk to their spouse. They’re the ones that don’t value their kids lives. So I need to overcome that.

Logan Shinholser
But nobody talks about what happens before the objections happen, and nobody talks about before the sales call happens, because in reality, the objections is like the last 5%, but you’re missing the 80% before the sales call, and you’re missing the 15% before the objections come. You’re focusing on the 5%, while the real victors here are the ones that focus on the 80%, then they focus on the 15%. Then at the end of it, they don’t really even have objections because you already done all the hard work up front. Yeah.

Chris Livingston
All the questions have been answered. If you had a conversation with someone and you’re able to say, hey, do you mind if we kind of adjust the elephant in the room? Yeah. What’s that? All right, sometimes I talk to people, and they have no idea what this stuff costs. And just so you have a clear understanding, I guess, is it cool if I kind of share with you just an idea of different costs that I’ve kind of dealt with? All right. So people that work with me have invested everything from $45,000 all up to $250,000. What are your thoughts on that? Because if you had a $15,000 budget and I just had 45. Oh, well, that’s 45. Okay. You know what I would just did? We just saved both of us a whole lot of time.

Chris Livingston
We also didn’t have to have you have the embarrassment after going through all these things that you love. And so it. It’s. It’s way better to get in front of these things. And if you can do it even before the call, you’re doing it the most effective way.

Logan Shinholser
Yeah, I like it. Well, cool. Guys, these objections are big. Knowing how to handle them is important. But what’s even more important is having an overall process, a sales process, and then also making sure that up front, you navigate the waters appropriately. So you shouldn’t even have to deal with this. This should be addressed upfront. Make it life that much easier.

Chris Livingston
Let’s do it.

Logan Shinholser
Cool. Guys, thank you very much. If you have not done so yet, if you liked this conversation and this helped you out at all, do me a favor. Drop a review below. Just let us know. Hey, how are we doing? Five star. One star. We just want to get a good gauge because what happens then is first off, it lets us know how we’re doing. But also the more reviews that we get, it’s easier for us to then go to big time influencers in the space that know more about this and, you know, can really move the needle to get them on board. But if they go well, you only have one review or whatever it is, it’s very tough because it doesn’t look as appealing. So you’d be helping us out, which in turn helps you out to bring you better knowledge.

Logan Shinholser
So right now, do me a favor. At the next red light that you get to pull over, leave us a review. Thank you very much.

Chris Livingston
See you guys.

Logan Shinholser
See ya.